Moving a vertex in deformed mode, moves it in non-deformed mode.

nicmar

See the video, is this really how it's supposed to work? I need to make mesh deformations, and toggle between deformed on and off, but when i move a key in deformed mode, it also moves the key in the non-deformed mode, which is very confusing.
If i disable edit mesh, move the vertex, and go back to edit mode, it didn't move, which is what i expect in the edit mesh mode as well.

It's very practical to do it right away inside the edit mesh, so i can more easily add more vertices when needed.
My version is 4.1.24.

According to the docs (https://en.esotericsoftware.com/spine-meshes#Edit-mode):
"When a vertex is translated, it changes the texture coordinates but does not change the position of the vertex outside of edit mode."

Also when i press "Reset", it breaks something in the animation, so the hair no longer moves along with the head. I think it's the same result as when i duplicate a skin and uncheck "Inherit timelines". It's also a bit confusing, as sometimes i want to reset and start over, but then the animation breaks, so i have to delete the skin, and make a duplicate of the original skin to keep the animation. I added another video below to show what happens. Just want to know if this is expected, and if there is a way to reset the mesh vertices, without breaking the animation.

I've had help from an animator to setup the animations, so i'm not sure how the connection is between the hair and the head, as the hair doesn't seem to have a bone..
Also the reason the hair looks so weird, is that this is the replacement solution for not using clipping attachments, where i instead change the mesh of the hair, to hide it behind a hat, which isn't visible in the spine at the moment. 🙂

Nate

nicmar is this really how it's supposed to work?

Yes. If you don't want to change UVs (the position on the image that corresponds to a vertex), don't enter edit mesh mode. Inside edit mesh mode, you are changing UVs. You can either change the UVs without changing the vertex position (deform unchecked) or change both (deform checked).

Moving mesh vertices is not generally a good way to see if more vertices are needed. Instead, create some reasonable vertices then create an animation that moves bones to the extremes of the desired movement. Adjust weights to get the behavior you want. If you can't, then you probably need to add vertices.

nicmar when i press "Reset", it breaks something in the animation

I assume you mean you press reset inside edit mode? That clears all the vertices and sets 4 new ones, one in each corner of the image. It also removes weights (a warning dialog is shown if it has weights). Both of those things can break your animations, if you used bone weights or deform keys.

If you reset your mesh to start over, your bone weights and deform keys aren't going to be valid anymore. Setup your meshes first. If you already have animations, edit the mesh without resetting it.

I don't understand much from your video, as I'm not familiar with your project, but you seem to be pressing reset in setup mode, outside of edit mesh. That resets the mesh's deformation (moving the vertices to match the UVs) and removes the weights (a warning dialog is shown if it has weights) and removes deform keys.

Your mesh was deformed in setup mode, so clicking reset removed that deform. I didn't see the warning dialog, so your mesh had no weights. Since your mesh stops deforming in preview, I assume it had deform keys that were deleted by the reset and that is why your animation changed. In the latest version of Spine, a "toast" message is shown when keys are deleted for an attachment:
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What version of Spine are you using?

nicmar i'm not sure how the connection is between the hair and the head, as the hair doesn't seem to have a bone

Hard to say, but look at the weights view to see what bones are bound to the mesh. If there are none, then the mesh will move/scale/rotate/shear from its parent bone, but won't otherwise bend unless it has deform keys. Using deform keys is not the recommended way to get movement like your animation shows, see here:
https://esotericsoftware.com/spine-keys#Deform-keys
You should use weights to deform your meshes. Use deform keys sparingly or not at all.

nicmar is there a way to view the vertices while not in edit mesh mode?

Select a mesh (with the translate, rotate, or scale shear tools) to see (and move) vertices outside of edit mesh mode.
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nicmar

Also, is there a way to view the vertices while not in edit mesh mode? I find it a lot easier to understand what's going on, but due to the problems with deformed mentioned above, i can't do the edits of the deformation in edit mesh mode 🙁

nicmar

Sorry for the late reply, but thanks for your detailed answer.

The problem i was trying to solve was that hair was sticking out from outside the hat, due to it being bigger than the hat.

I got the result that I wanted, instead of using clipping attachments, to hide parts of the hair, I instead use mesh deform to shrink parts of the hair to make it fit inside the hat.

This idea doesn’t use animations, it just moves the mesh vertices when a certain skin is applied.

Do you mean it’s better to use scale than to just move the vertices? Would using this method be bad for performance?

Thanks!

Nate

Generally bone weights are better than deform keys, for the reasons described at the link above.

If you want to cut off part of the mesh, you can do that in edit mesh mode. In some cases it makes sense to duplicate an attachment and use edit mesh to cut off some parts, then you can switch between then various versions of the same mesh with different parts cut off.